trotski2000 2017-01-13 03:45:20
Xanather: because they want to show some muscle. It's politics. There's no real technical point against segwit. They are making a political point, they want to be heard. But at the end of the day self-interest will prevail - and activating segwit is good for their investment.
arubi 2017-01-13 03:45:51
I don't even think it's that. they're probably running old software
trotski2000 2017-01-13 03:46:10
arubi: I think it's a bit of both things.
Xanather 2017-01-13 03:46:45
trotski2000, so you think it'll shoot up to 95% at the last second?
frib 2017-01-13 03:47:01
is segwit even a permanent solution?
Xanather 2017-01-13 03:47:04
while there are pools who have specifically said they will block segwit that accounts for more than 5%
trotski2000 2017-01-13 03:47:07
Xanather: when is the last second?
grubles 2017-01-13 03:47:19
to tx malleability and other things, yes
Xanather 2017-01-13 03:47:22
trotski2000, afaik segwit signalling only lasts a year
grubles 2017-01-13 03:47:40
i guess some miners don't want those bugs fixed
frib 2017-01-13 03:47:40
to scalability
trotski2000 2017-01-13 03:48:00
frib: segwit enables LN which is a solution to scalability
frib 2017-01-13 03:48:08
what is LN?
trotski2000 2017-01-13 03:48:30
frib: lightning network - one of the most exciting things that happened in the cryptocurrency space since Bitcoin :)
trotski2000 2017-01-13 03:48:38
frib: check https://lightning.network/lightning-network-summary.pdf
piqure 2017-01-13 03:48:39
^^^ WARNING: any URL may lead directly or indirectly to COIN-STEALING MALWARE! ^^^
grubles 2017-01-13 03:48:55
frib> what is LN? <- srs?
frib 2017-01-13 03:49:14
wasn't that the multisig thing?
Xanather 2017-01-13 03:49:26
is it possible to have transaction malleability fix outside SegWit? I think it should've been separate
grubles 2017-01-13 03:50:02
no i think the block "size" increase is just a by-product of fixing malleability
grubles 2017-01-13 03:50:12
i could be wrong though..
trotski2000 2017-01-13 03:50:23
frib: Lighting network enables scalability in the order of millions of transactions per seconds (or even billions)
frib 2017-01-13 03:50:44
trotski2000, does it have any major disadvantages?
trotski2000 2017-01-13 03:51:26
frib: it also enables microtransactions. And last but not least, it enables 0 confirmations transactions to be 100% secure
trotski2000 2017-01-13 03:51:27
frib: not that I know.
frib 2017-01-13 03:52:12
trotski2000, but but btc in addresses with unconfirmed transactions would still be unspendable?
trotski2000 2017-01-13 03:52:36
frib: LN transactions are offchain
frib 2017-01-13 03:53:01
trotski2000, so where are they stored ?
trotski2000 2017-01-13 03:53:38
frib: in a smart contract
trotski2000 2017-01-13 03:53:45
frib: see https://lightning.network/lightning-network-paper.pdf
piqure 2017-01-13 03:53:46
^^^ WARNING: any URL may lead directly or indirectly to COIN-STEALING MALWARE! ^^^
frib 2017-01-13 03:54:16
oh
Xanather 2017-01-13 03:54:37
grubles, seems possible without segwit https://github.com/bitcoin/bips/blob/master/bip-0062.mediawiki
piqure 2017-01-13 03:54:38
^^^ WARNING: any URL may lead directly or indirectly to COIN-STEALING MALWARE! ^^^
frib 2017-01-13 03:54:57
so LN is impossible without segwit?
Xanather 2017-01-13 03:55:20
it always was, it was just crippled without a malleability fix
frib 2017-01-13 03:55:39
always was possible you mean
Xanather 2017-01-13 03:55:51
yeah sorry
Xanather 2017-01-13 04:00:13
its a soft-fork too
Xanather 2017-01-13 04:00:27
sigh
Avatar 2017-01-13 04:01:04
so hi how I get a safe wallet
Xanather 2017-01-13 04:01:58
Avatar, Trezor or Ledger Wallet
trotski2000 2017-01-13 04:01:58
Avatar: look for Bitcoin Core
Avatar 2017-01-13 04:02:40
ok the bitcoin core is started by me
Avatar 2017-01-13 04:03:10
how i get my money to bitcoin
Michail1 2017-01-13 04:09:11
Avatar - Purchase from an exchange, ATM, or find someone for over the counter trading like localbitcoins.com or in #bitcoin-otc
Avatar 2017-01-13 04:10:03
thx heaven bless you
mryandao 2017-01-13 04:16:36
excluding mimblewimble, what'd be alternative measures to increase fungibility for bitcoin?
grubles 2017-01-13 04:16:59
joinmarket, tumblebit, confidential transactions
grubles 2017-01-13 04:17:16
ring signatures maybe? don't know if that is possible with bitcoin.
mryandao 2017-01-13 04:17:24
i thought CT still show where inputs/outputs go to
mryandao 2017-01-13 04:17:29
it just hides the amounts no?
grubles 2017-01-13 04:17:39
not sure
mryandao 2017-01-13 04:18:16
i'm guessing tumblebit will eventually supercede joinmarket, since it provides trustless-ness
grubles 2017-01-13 04:18:41
right
mryandao 2017-01-13 04:19:14
could u do mixing with scnhorr sigs?
frib 2017-01-13 04:24:07
wouldn't LN still be unable to prevent deliberate crowding of the blockchain?
frib 2017-01-13 04:25:47
is seg-wit adoption directly proportional to the pool of unconfirmed transactions?
moli_ 2017-01-13 04:26:16
hm?
gmaxwell 2017-01-13 04:26:45
grubles: it's possible but it has poor scaling. I'm more fond of CT+CJ (including varrious kinds of non-interactive CJ) simply because they have good scaling.
grubles 2017-01-13 04:28:02
moli_ 2017-01-13 04:34:07
gmaxwell, i saw the slides of this presentation, what do you think of it: https://twitter.com/real_or_random/status/812379888426557440
piqure 2017-01-13 04:34:07
^^^ WARNING: any URL may lead directly or indirectly to COIN-STEALING MALWARE! ^^^
gmaxwell 2017-01-13 04:36:15
moli_: it's great work but I was a little torqued that they made it sound like it was unknown if you could do that with CT. CT was designed for that, and the API in elements for even even has affordances for it. :P
gmaxwell 2017-01-13 04:36:24
First world problems.
moli_ 2017-01-13 04:38:46
gmaxwell, but CT is still unknown to most people
